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Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

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Kern3l

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Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 8:14 am

Post Thu Oct 14, 2010 10:08 am

Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

Heyo all, it's my first post here and probably it'll get big ;] Going straight to the thing, idea is to:

=> Create internet app, that will help people learn flipping fast and efficiently <=

How it will work? It will guide through next tricks, suggesting you next ones basing on those already known.

Look, bali tricks can be:
  • 1. Simplest trick of kind, that don't use any part of easier one (beware, simplest means easiest here). Let's call them 'fundamental'.
  • 2. More hard trick which use part(s)/whole(s) of more basic trick(s). Let's call them 'complex'.

Those tricks can be represented by mathematical directed graph (dots with arrows between them - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graph_(mathematics)#Directed_graph). Vertices (dots) are tricks, edges (arrows) are dependences. Dependences can be 'weighted' which is the 'meaning' of edge.

For example we have 'fast opening' (which is not easy) and more basic 'up-down-up opening' (which is easy). They depend completely on themselves, first is just faster version of second. Part of graph representing this could be:
(up-down-up opening)--[100%]-->(fast opening)

So we've got graph representation of tricks and dependiences between them. What for? I want to create internet app, where people can register and in every trick they can check how good they are in it (left/right hand separately).

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Every trick will have (at least):
  • Name with optional aliases
  • Difficulty
  • Description*
  • Author*
  • Transition (in what hold/grip you start and finish)
  • Tutorial videos (embedded from, for example, youtube)
* - optional

Name with aliases, for example: "basic horizontal" aka "basic opener" aka "first-trick-you-learn" (ofc joking, moreover in my case it wasn't true ;])

Difficulty - it will be a number from 1 to 100, but as it is completely arbitrary I'll start with names {'easy', 'intermediate', 'hard'} (technically there will be: 25 -> easy, 50 -> intermediate, 75 -> hard), so there will be area to develop it later.

Description - anything ;]

Author - if known.

Transition - okay, we have 8 basic holds/grips. We have to name them, so we will know what is what. As you can hold one handle by pinch grip or second with fingers (except for thumb) without rotating bali, we will not distinguish them. Bali can be hold:
opened/closed; forehand/backhand; bitehandle/safehandle

Let's say we have this convention: bite/safe handle is from the handle hold by all fingers except for thumb (common convention). Second convention: in abbreviations we will write big letter for forehand/backhand (more readable) ;]

We create abbreviations from the first letters from above. For example:
opened backhand safehandle grip == oBs
closed forehand bitehandle grip == cFb
and so on ;]

I'm thinking about making abbreviations for tricks, that can be done from/to both closed/opened, forehand/backhand, bite/safe handle. For example fast opening can be done from both bite/safe handle, so it could be 'x'/'X' in this place, and transition could be written like this:
cFx -> oFx

Any suggestions for more common grips, different than those 8?

Why do we need those written by every trick? Except for obvious profits, I can make (later) for example combo maker, which will make combos from your known tricks ;]

Tutorial videos - the more the better ;] We have many great casters over the net, so gathering their vids for a trick on one page and adding possibility to vote on them (will be sorted by points descending) would be nice - if users [+] on vids that helped them to learn, we will have best tutorials first ;]

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On user accounts - they can be extended by many things like list of owned balis, etc. Basically all progress on tricks WILL BE PRIVATE, so people will be much more frank with their own progress assessment.

I'm thinking about voting on aliases - it's arbitrary which name is 'best'.

Also I'm thinking about progress history keeping.

What I need? Several things, few from forum admins, few from you all, one from myself ;]

Admins - this would be great if I could connect my site with brokenbrains.us - meaning:
- my own subforum with announcements, suggestions, etc.
- links from my site to arena (as "forum") and wiki (as "wiki"), and links from both to my site (will be flipping.kern3l.net - nothing useful there yet ;]) with "flipping guide"/"learning guide"/etc. name (haven't decided exact name yet).

From you all - I will do technical stuff, but I need people that will gather informations about tricks (maybe I will give access to admin panel to some of you). If I get my own subforum, I'll create topics for it.
Also, I need ideas from you, what do you want and what is in your opinion obsolete ;]

From myself - develop idea and implement it ;] It will take some time, because I have many other things to do, but will be finished faster or later ;]

---

First of all I'm making database for it. Because databases structure is unchangeable, I don't want to add data prematurely ;] I have to know what will be done, so I can set up db right. Later I will program algorithms for selection of suggested tricks, user accounts, etc. The last thing will be visuals, which will be sucky in the beginning ;]

Everything will be done in django (python), I just hope it will be working properly (and fast) on my hosting ;]

Cheers!
Kern3l
Last edited by Kern3l on Tue Nov 16, 2010 9:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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sheneniganer

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Post Thu Oct 14, 2010 10:49 am

Re: Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

Before posting this, maybe you should have read the forum rules, then you would have known to introduce yourself, after that then you could PM Jason, the owner, about this inquiry instead of just making a public thread asking for all of these priveleges, it comes across as a very arrogant and self centered act. Just posting this out of the blue, without introducing yourself, will not get you very far here.

As for the idea, I dont know how effective it would be.
6 Out of 18. What are you?
/ Rolling with the cutting edge of a new order.
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Kern3l

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Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 8:14 am

Post Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:09 am

Re: Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

Oh, you took me wrong, it wasn't meant to be arrogant at all. Of course you're right, I should have done what you said.

Now I'm going to do what you suggested and I hope everything will straighten up ;]
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droopdog666

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Post Fri Oct 15, 2010 6:49 am

Re: Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

im not sure why, but this kind of rubs me the wrong way. :?
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takeiteazy3

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Post Fri Oct 15, 2010 1:00 pm

Re: Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

Internet app?

I think youtube has that covered... no?
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Kern3l

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Post Fri Oct 15, 2010 2:56 pm

Re: Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

takeiteazy3 wrote:Internet app?

I think youtube has that covered... no?


Not at all, have you read the whole post? ;] The main points of this app are:
  • Learn tricks in proper order - don't take complex and struggle for some time, when you could master easier tricks and do this complex one effortless. Youtube doesn't support it unless someone writes it in comments, I haven't seen many of this, it's rare.
  • Know what can I do next (the bigger tricks database, the better the result - the idea how it will suggest next tricks is detailed in first post). Of course you can browse youtube, but what if it was much, much faster with instant list of suggested tricks in your profile?
  • Motivate to develop skill in both hands. With separate assessment for both hands, you will have separate lists of known and suggested tricks for left and right.

In short: this will be to keep your priorities straight without need of time-consuming browsing ;]

I offer you very nice learning platform for free, I hope you will appreciate it ;]

Btw. I've written whole database, now I'm writing code that operates on it (started with user accounts). After I've done some basic functionality and look (+ fill with some tricks), I'll upload it on server and will gladly welcome all the critique ;]
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sheneniganer

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Post Mon Oct 18, 2010 8:09 am

Re: Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

droopdog666 wrote:im not sure why, but this kind of rubs me the wrong way. :?

thats how i felt...
Kern3l wrote:
takeiteazy3 wrote:Internet app?

I think youtube has that covered... no?


Not at all, have you read the whole post? ;] The main points of this app are:
  • Learn tricks in proper order - don't take complex and struggle for some time, when you could master easier tricks and do this complex one effortless. Youtube doesn't support it unless someone writes it in comments, I haven't seen many of this, it's rare.
  • Know what can I do next (the bigger tricks database, the better the result - the idea how it will suggest next tricks is detailed in first post). Of course you can browse youtube, but what if it was much, much faster with instant list of suggested tricks in your profile?
  • Motivate to develop skill in both hands. With separate assessment for both hands, you will have separate lists of known and suggested tricks for left and right.

In short: this will be to keep your priorities straight without need of time-consuming browsing ;]

I offer you very nice learning platform for free, I hope you will appreciate it ;]

Btw. I've written whole database, now I'm writing code that operates on it (started with user accounts). After I've done some basic functionality and look (+ fill with some tricks), I'll upload it on server and will gladly welcome all the critique ;]


good luck, but everyone learns at diferent paces and learns diferent moves easier than others, I'm not saying cant or wont work, but I think you are trying to fix something that isnt broke.
6 Out of 18. What are you?
/ Rolling with the cutting edge of a new order.
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Kern3l

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Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 8:14 am

Post Mon Oct 18, 2010 1:11 pm

Re: Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

good luck, but everyone learns at diferent paces and learns diferent moves easier than others, I'm not saying cant or wont work, but I think you are trying to fix something that isnt broke.


I know what you mean. Still, this will be useful for people asking: "okay, I know some tricks, what should I learn now?". In my example, this will be useful for tracking tricks that still need special attention (I tend to forgot some older tricks I don't particularly like) and remind me how bad is my right hand (I'm a left-hander ;]). I doubt this will be very popular, but to some extension this will be useful for some people ;]
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Jason

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Post Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:45 am

Re: Internet App helping efficiently learn flipping

There was some mention of making some php scrips that would help tie tricks together, based off info entered in the flipping wiki database, but nothing came off it.

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